Juliano · Pinetree

[0:05]Back for another better call is all yaps. I'm here with Juliano from Pine Tree. What's up Juliano? How are you doing today? I'm great. How are you doing? I'm doing amazing. It's a beautiful day here. I know you said it was a warm day where you are as well, so Good, good, good to be outside, get the fresh air.

[0:23]Excited to talk to you today. Um, excited to chat a little bit more about Pine Tree and, uh, I would just, uh, love to get like a little intro, if you wanna share a little bit more about yourself and, and who you are. Yeah. So my name is Juliano. Um, I'm originally from Brazil, um, and, um, I went to school, uh, in the northeast at MIT.

[0:48]Um, and, um, been in tech for a long time. Funny story, I was really early into AI and now AI is the hot thing. So, um, I studied, um. With Minsky who created the field of ai, uh, was head of CEO for a little bit, and then Windstone was head of CEO, which is the AI lab at MIT worked, you know, my master's within.

[1:21]Um, and uh, I also wrote a book about, you know, ai, which is kind of interesting. What's the book called? Uh, making Things Think. Um. And, uh, funny story, um, as well, I got into Transformers, the team, GPT, uh, Chad, GPT, uh, which is the type of neuro network that, you know, is used really early on. So on GPT two I realized, oh shit, this is quite interesting.

[1:51]'cause DeepMind was using a similar neural network architecture. I wrote about it, the post went completely viral. Uh, it was like explaining transformers. Maybe half a million view or million views, uh, on the internet. It's one of the most popular posts on Transformers. Um, and I also like, uh, taught one of the co-founders of Philanthropic how Transformers work.

[2:15]He was like in the same community as me in sf. Uh, he joined Open AI, was the co-author of G PT three, and eventually, uh, joined, uh, entropic. Um, but I, I'm like a very markets driven guy. I love markets and I mean, as many people got like, uh, understood Bitcoin crypto early on, uh, I, you know, I eventually learned about Bitcoin and crypto in 12, 2012.

[2:50]Uh, I mean, got introduced it maybe even before. In college. 'cause it was funny, when I was doing my master's, one of the guys in the group that was in the AI lab, uh, he was mining Bitcoin, his own computer. I was like, oh, this, the guy was like, pretty nuts. But he's like extremely smart. One of the Yeah. People can be.

[3:13]Yeah. I mean he, to have an idea, he started a company that Minsky used to talk about these like freezing brains. So he started a company that was funded by Teo and sent Altman, I think as well to like freeze, uh, brains after death. Uh, so he does work with like pigs and stuff. Um, but yeah, so he, uh, what, and a few friends of mine were like early at Coinbase, like really early at Coinbase.

[3:48]Like fifth, uh, guy, Coinbase. Um, but I think the concept, like the Bitcoin concept and, and eventually crypto clicked to me, um, later on, maybe in 1716. Um, and I really got into like a lot of the Bitcoin, uh, understanding Bitcoin, how it works and everything. Um, at that time, the only thing is that I just didn't have much money to invest.

[4:24]'cause I, I started my company back in 13. I had a startup back then. Um, eventually joined other startups, um, and eventually moved down to, to the Bay Area to work in a startup, uh, like start working with them when they had the first customer. Um, the company was, is called Transcend, uh, and they work in basically helping companies with privacy related stuff.

[4:54]So they, uh, I started with when they were like, just with one customer and end up, uh, becoming director of engineering, um, and leaving after their series B. Um, so I, I directed a few teams there. Um, and uh, at the end it was like, uh, three teams. Um, and I, I, I mean, I, I really like love crypto in general, Bitcoin and crypto because as I mentioned, I'm like really into markets and the economy and things like that.

[5:35]And I think a lot of crypto, it is about markets. It's about, you know. Um, uh, it's all about markets, I think at the end of the day. And, um, and so, um, in like a year and a half ago, I met up with Android 16. I was like, oh, I'm working on this idea. And we jumped together. Um, and we've been working full-time basically in the past year.

[6:07]So we've been working a lot this past year, full time. Um, and uh, so we started with basically, you know, the, the own chain platform for video creators, uh, to give them control of monetization, distribution, um, and um, and content ownership. Um, and we've been working on the product since then. Um. It's, uh, startups are an interesting journey.

[6:39]They are hard, like they're really hard. Um, and it reminds me of the days, uh, of Math Olympians. 'cause I'm like a math Olympia. Huh? Um, I'm like, I did a bunch of Olympia, like Science Olympian. I did like physics, chemistry, astronomy for math and math. But like, I think math was, and that was all in, in Brazil.

[7:03]Yeah. Um, very cool. And I won a bunch of medals. Um, so, um, uh, math was like the hardest to me. I think I was the best in physics. Um, but like math, I think I'm like the, like, I think it's the hardest subject of all. And, and because of that, I was able to go to school here. Uh, in the US So I end up going to the, uh, to school there in Boston.

[7:34]Yeah, I've traveled around the, the, the MIT grounds a lot. I had a summer school actually there 'cause I'm from the suburbs of Boston. So like, definitely spent, spent my fair terror share of time there. Definitely. Uh, yeah. Beautiful, beautiful area to go to school in the, in the us Yeah, I was, I mean I was looking at it and like looking at the other schools there in the northeast, I'm like.

[7:58]I'm very lucky to have gone there. 'cause like, uh, I end up only applying there because the other schools here in like, my English wasn't good enough. I was like, good enough to pass to get the minimum score. Um, M-I-T-M-I-T had a score that was lower than other schools. Um. And, uh, my math and physics and everything, I scored maximum, but like, just English was like really low.

[8:25]And funnily enough, I almost went to Tokyo to study as well, uh, instead of MIT. But my English wasn't good enough to learn Japanese in English, but it was good enough to come to the US. But I had trouble at the beginning because it was like trouble, meaning it was like hard, uh, my, like, to take classes that were more focused on like known science stuff.

[8:51]Um, but yeah, like I was just talking to Android about this and like startups remind me a lot of like meth olympiads because it's like, it's intense, it's hard. And, um. And do you wanna give an explanation of what a Math Olympiad is for people that might not know that? Yeah. So like, math Olympias, they, it depends on the type of, like they're, how, like, you know, they're different kind of olympias, like the, the main one high school is like the International Math Olympiad pit.

[9:24]Um, and what usually how this usually works that you have tests. You have, like, you know, maybe, so like the Brazilian meth Olympian, you have two days, four hours and a half. I think that was it. Uh, each day is four hours and a half of a test. Like you do it over the weekend and um, and each day you have like three, three problem problems.

[9:54]Uh, and you basically have to solve them and they're pretty hard. So like, yeah. You may have like a problem in geometry that's like, you need to like figure out the solution, things like that. Um, and like for example, different oly, uh, Olympians, Olympiads have like different kind of, uh, tests and things like that.

[10:15]So like chemistry for example has, um, the practical part where you actually have to, you know, do stuff, uh, uh, but you also have like the written test. Um, physics as well. You have like the practical one and you also have the written one. Um, like depending on the Olympiad, um, there are olympiads that, you know, have less money, so, uh, they only have like written tasks.

[10:44]Um, but yeah, and like they basically, you know, the top ones get medals. Uh, the top students and you may have like different stages. So like Math Olympia in Brazil had three stages so you can parse out people. Um, and because of that, I was, I think, you know, that allowed me to go to MIT. But you know, Olympia, it's, they are like extremely hard.

[11:11]If you want to be the top of the game. It's like olympiads in the real world. It's also really hard. You know, it's like, it's intense and like you're basically competing with the best in that field. And one thing that people don't talk about that's interesting is that for Olympiads, there are personality traits that make some people better than others.

[11:36]Um. Like, yeah, Megan, I can see how that applies to startups really well. Right? Because it's about that like tenacity of consistency in one aspect as well as the ability to, to showcase skill at a specific moment and value, right? Um, and I, I think that's really interesting to learn more about the Olympiad.

[11:57]I don't know if I had any of that growing up, or maybe that was just the standardized testing in the US and the highest people would do that. But, um, but no, that's. That's really cool to to hear and I could see that parallel to, to then the startups. It sounds like you've been in startups for quite some time, right?

[12:13]Yeah, I, I've been, yeah. The, yeah, with Olympiads, they're like, in the US you have like people also doing oly here in the US and they go to, you know, the international ones and the US is like usually the top one or second depending. It's like US and China, like always first and second. Um. But yeah, it's like with startups, it's, I think the, uh, there are traits that are like a bit different.

[12:41]Um, I think resilience is like a big thing. Uh, Paul Han has an essay about this, uh, where he talks about, you know, what he sees of like, you know, founders, um, what makes great founders, and it's kind of funny 'cause he also talked about Saint Altman being a great founder. And being at the top, like, you know, like Steve Jobs and, you know, uh, and when I read the first time, I'm like, ah, I don't know if he's like saying like, this is true and now you see open ai, right?

[13:14]Like they just raise, uh, apparently. Uh, he was talking about raising, uh, or like the new, in the news people were talking, uh, that they, they raised a hundred billion at $150 billion valuation. Um, and yeah, there's like consistency. There's like, there are a few trades there, like pretty important. Um, I think the most interesting or most important trait that.

[13:43]Uh, I think it's like this resilience that, uh, you know, and also, um, being able to handle, uh, the ups and downs of startups. 'cause there's like a lot of ups and downs and it's like, it's pretty hardcore. Um, but yeah, I've learned a lot, uh, at Transcend. So like the founders are amazing. Like they are like, I love them and you know, like they are great people in general.

[14:13]Um, but yeah, it's, it, it is what it is. It's pretty hardcore. Um, and so, uh, when like, you know, when people mention, oh, this startup, like they should have done this or that, it's like when you are at the game, it's like, it's, it's completely different, you know? Um, but yeah, uh, that's a little bit more about me and, you know, uh, my background and, uh, yeah.

[14:40]Yeah, it's easy to play armchair quarterback from the other side of the internet. Right? So, uh, I, I can understand that a little bit in just watching in my experience. Um, I'd love to talk a little bit more about you, Andrew, 16 and, uh, and Ree share a little bit more about what you guys are building, um, what you guys have been working on here.

[14:59]I know you shared a little bit about it, but let's dive in deep. Yeah. Um, yeah, the, just a, a side comment on the. On the quarterback, uh, armchair. Um, yeah, I mean, I don't know if you've been following on Farer, but there has been a discussion of it because Ben was talking about it. Uh, and in some ways I agree.

[15:26]Uh, like when you are at it, it's like completely different than, you know, when you're not building it. Um, so I agree with that. I, I think there's also points of like, uh, feedback and things like that, that, that some people like, it's important to listen to people and what they are saying and things like that.

[15:51]Um, so like, I think there are two, the two sides of the ta, the, the coin, you know, uh, one, one side is like. As I mentioned, like it's really hard to build a startup. Um, but also on the other side, um, the, it's important to listen to what people have to say. 'cause some people may, may be right about stuff, you know?

[16:18]Um, so that's that. Uh, in terms of what we're building, we're, we're basically, you know, as, uh, we mentioned basically, uh. Giving creators a lot more, uh, ownership of, uh, monetization distribution, content owner ownership. I think what we're gonna focus a lot more is monetization. Um, so right now, you know, distribution, um, you like a lot, lots of platforms where you know you can get distribution.

[16:55]Uh, but where crypto really shines is on monetization. So we're gonna focus a lot on monetization, um, in the coming months. Uh, so like, how can we make, for example, uh, a creator, uh, monetize a lot better their content and things like that. Um, so we're gonna focus a lot on that, uh, in the next year. Um, and yeah, so that's a little bit more right now.

[17:25]Uh, creators can, it's very simple and we integrate it a lot with forecaster. Um, that was like our initial go to market. Um, and we're gonna expand our go to market now that we're, you know, uh, uh, in this coming year. Um, but we're gonna. Uh, help creators monetize a lot more, so making sure that they can make money very easily, um, and much more easily than, you know, with other platforms.

[17:55]And, um, so that's where we're gonna focus on, on the next, you know, in the next year. Uh, but yeah, uh, that's a little bit more about Ree right now. Creators can create long form videos, like short term form videos. Uh, there are comments, people can create live streams and things like that. And you can search, see profiles.

[18:19]So it's very simple for now. And our like, because we built kind of the infrastructure for, for, for creators, now we can focus a lot more on the. On the Monet on, on the monetization side. So that's where we're gonna focus a lot more and maybe be able to use other distribution channels, uh, like X or you know, YouTube or whatever, uh, but still be able to monetize for our platform.

[18:50]No, I like that a lot. I think there's a lot of benefit to creators, um, for, you know, bringing that profit margin to them and building in that monetization. I think, um, a lot of crypto rallies around that. Like you said, there's a lot of pros and cons of that incentive through monetization as well, and I think there's so much that can be captured there.

[19:13]But the really amazing thing is. Um, when you get distribution, I think everyone, um, as an artist and everyone that is, um, looking to make sales, that distribution mechanism and funnel is such an important thing. And building on top of that, like you said. Growing it on something like X or YouTube and being able to pull that in, I think could be a huge, huge step towards that.

[19:38]Because anything that helps distribution, I think, um, is something that artists will start to flock towards. Yeah, exactly. Yeah. So that's that. I mean, that's what we're building. We've been building for a year. Um, so we've been heads down, uh, building, uh, creating a product, talking to customers, um. And, uh, yeah, and um, um, uh, it's like a iterative process.

[20:08]You know, like you talk to people, you figure out, oh, okay, this is what's happening. You look at the data, you look at what's going on, and then you improve over time. And, uh, um, I mean, that's the whole process of like building products. So. Yeah. No, that's awesome. Uh, it was awesome to have you. Do you wanna share a little bit more about where people can reach out to you, where people can check out Pine Tree?

[20:33]Yeah. I mean, they can go on Pine Tree, so, um, and, uh, uh, it's, yeah, uh, we, I usually share, uh, links on Far Caster, uh, as well. Uh, there's a mini app there. Uh, but yeah, that's basically it, you know. Awesome. Yeah. And your forecaster username is just, uh, GIU, uh, right in there. So, uh, people should, should turn out your forecaster to, to get in contact with Juliano.

[21:05]Is there, um, anything you wanna share here with us in the last, uh, last bit, um, about Ree, about yourself? Um, something you wanna share with us as we're leaving here today? Yeah, I mean, not much. I mean, we probably will have more news, uh. You know, in the coming weeks or months. Uh, so I've been heads down building a lot, heads down building.

[21:28]That's the best thing to do in this, um, time period with where crypto's at, right? Yeah, yeah, exactly. So if there's more, we'll share more stuff, but yeah. We're a heads down building. Uh, yeah, I love it. Heads down, building. That's the best thing you can be doing nowadays, especially with all the advances in everything, you know, whether you look at the, but on the actual tech side of the product side.

[21:51]So continuing to build and iterate on the product. Love to hear it. We love to, to hear all of our artists and, and builders out there doing that. Um, I appreciate you for coming on today, Giuliano. Awesome. Uh, yeah, awesome talking to you rest of your day here. All right, peace. See you.

[22:07]We say you free, decentralized, let's.